Properties window, document best usage from input device

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freedman
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Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby freedman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:27 pm

I have learned here that even though we think we have the same program is doesn't always work the same. :) I use Win10 and win7 machines.
When I edit the properties values ( lower left window) I seem to get some different actions from different options. For instance, some values seem to update as numbers are entered in real time and others require mouse events. The first thing I noticed, in many fields if I change the value I need to mouse click in a field above or below to get the data updated, the enter key on the keyboard does not seem to enter data.

Has this been documented and is there some common thread that describes the procedure, I always just watch the graphics screen and click around and sometimes forget and hit the enter key. Using the enter key is almost worse because the field data is entered but no recompute takes place. I see nothing in the properties documentation on best use. This has to be very confusing for new users, that's why I bring it up.
chrisb
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Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby chrisb » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:48 pm

My observation is that this does not depend on different program versions, but on the complexity of a model. Simple models react on every keypress, whil erecomputing is suppressed with complex models. This is convenient and sensible, although it may seem to be somewhat arbitrary. It would be good to have this documented.
freedman
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Location: Washington State, USA

Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby freedman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:32 pm

I guess I should ask something specific. I have learned (over time) that in the properties window (no matter what the complexity of the model) don't use the enter key, it doesn't do anything. I can click it and it does nothing bad but it also does nothing to the model or the data. I am in Gesture mode. Is that what others see?
Thanks
chrisb
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Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:14 am

Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby chrisb » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:22 am

On my Mac with gesture mode I see this behaviour in Part workbench:
  • If I create a primitive such as cube or cylinder and change the properties, e.g. width of the cube, then each keypress changes the object in 3D view.
  • If I make a fusion of such primitives the behaviour changes: A keypress does nothing except changing the value in the input field and making the recompute icon active.

    Enter or tab executes the recompute.
OS: macOS 10.13
Word size of OS: 64-bit
Word size of FreeCAD: 64-bit
Version: 0.18.16087 (Git)
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Python version: 3.7.1
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freedman
Posts: 1616
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Location: Washington State, USA

Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby freedman » Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:34 am

freedman wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:32 pm
I guess I should ask something specific. I have learned (over time) that in the properties window (no matter what the complexity of the model) don't use the enter key, it doesn't do anything. I can click it and it does nothing bad but it also does nothing to the model or the data. I am in Gesture mode. Is that what others see?
Thanks
Edit: This is in Part design.
freedman
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Location: Washington State, USA

Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby freedman » Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:05 am

I want to write this up in a bug report. I will target Part design for now, I'm sure other WB have issues also but since all the WB have their own interface, I will stop there. I'm going to recommend that after editing a value in the Properties field, pressing the "Enter" key should do a recompute.
Does anyone see a problem with that?
The real question; Is there a reason it works the way it does and the developers did this intentionally. At the very least it needs to be looked at, we need to try to use one of the most common key sequences for data input, the "Enter" key.
chrisb
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Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby chrisb » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:35 am

I like to have two easy to use possibilities to enter values with and without triggering a recompute.

I would like to hear other meanings, but I think it should be the other way round:

"Enter" as the name says enters the value in the model, and it seems natural to me that a recompute is performed.
"Tab" only changes the input field, no immediate recompute required.

Example for why I want this: Having a complex model a recompute can well take 10 seconds. If I change x, y, and z component that means 30s - or some fumbling with the mouse, popup menus to switch recomputes off.
It is great to have an easy possibility to enter values without recompute.
GeneFC
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Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby GeneFC » Thu Mar 14, 2019 2:49 pm

freedman wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:05 am
Does anyone see a problem with that?
I believe I have seen a number of threads in which you complained about slow response times in FreeCAD. This would be another way to create slow response times. :?

Gene
freedman
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Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby freedman » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:42 pm

chrisb »
"Enter" as tha name says enters the value in the model, and it seems natural to me that a recompute is performed.
"Tab" only changes the input field, no immediate recompute required.
I like that approach. Simple to use.
Add to that, "Tab" wraps around i.e. if it gets to end end of the prperties then the next tab will move the cursor to the first property.
If the prior stuff was done, the GUI would feel like a typical computer interface for beginners and still have many short-cuts for the advanced user.
GeneFC » This would be another way to create slow response times.
Why would it slow thing down?
I believe I have seen a number of threads in which you complained about slow response times in FreeCAD.
I support the prograrm here by my comments, I try to stay professional and mostly serious. I have stated before, "none of my comments are complaints, just my observations". If it runs slow then I comment that it runs slow, I presume the programmers here want the feedback even though we all mess up every once in a while.

Thanks
GeneFC
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Re: Properties window, document best usage from input device

Postby GeneFC » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:30 pm

Sorry, I was not trying to be snide or anything of the sort.

The serious topic is that recomputes can indeed cause slowdowns. And you have certainly "mentioned" slow actions several times in other threads. (I will retract the term "complain".)

You asked for comments, and I suggested an important consideration. Nothing else.

Gene