UI redesign question

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chrisb
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby chrisb » Thu Mar 15, 2018 5:27 pm

Actually I don't feel happy to depend on a Microsoft license, even if they give it for free. That's still something different than open software.
safri_jefro
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby safri_jefro » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:33 pm

With a litle bit of tinkering a familiar style of UI is easy to achieve. It is not a ribbon style per se but it feels intuitive. A bit of Solidworks 2012 esque.

At the top you have the generic command with the view settings next to them.
Below i used the selector toolbar and tweaked the standard settings.
All workbench specific commands are placed at the left side of the screen.
For mechanical engineering this works really well! The dark/blue settings are really the finishing touch as it highlights the active workbench nicely.

The selector toolbar is really somewhat of a hidden gem and from my part can receive a more central role in the UI as it fits the philosophy of workbenches.
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Joel_graff
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby Joel_graff » Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:49 am

chrisb wrote:
Thu Mar 15, 2018 5:27 pm
Actually I don't feel happy to depend on a Microsoft license, even if they give it for free. That's still something different than open software.
As I read it, the license was only if you wished to adopt the Fluent UI that they developed for MS Office, and I think it was to legally require you not to use it to compete directly with MS Office. consider it an early attempt for them to be open-sourcey. :) So far as I can tell, though, you couldn't even sign up for it if you wanted - Microsoft no longer offers it.

That said, I don't see evidence that MS would litigate against anyone for adopting a Ribbon UI, license or otherwise, especially if the software doesn't compete with their flagship products.

Here's the details I've found regarding the case against Corel. Note that the Corel products cited in the lawsuit are WordPerfect and QuattroPro - Corel's office suites - and again, it was for their adoption of the Fluent UI, not the ribbon UI element.

"Microsoft argued that Corel willfully infringed the ’828, ’036, ’237, ’140, ’532, and ’865 patents. The asserted Microsoft patents are directed to graphic user interfaces used in Microsoft products, such as Microsoft Office. Microsoft asserted that it has given its interfaces, including menus and toolbars, a distinctive look and feel, which Corel copied into the accused products, including WordPerfect X7. WordPerfect X7 even includes an option to use the product in the “Microsoft Word mode.” See Complaint para 3-5. Similarly, Quatro Pro X7 offers the option to use the product in the “Microsoft Excel mode.” See Complaint para. 6-8. "

I would also point out that LibreOffice 5.3 introduced a ribbon UI to it's office suite. No signs of lawsuits from Microsoft.

Again, not arguing for a Ribbon UI, but I don't think we should be too concerned should someone want to develop one.
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Joel_graff
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby Joel_graff » Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:53 am

safri_jefro wrote:
Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:33 pm
The selector toolbar is really somewhat of a hidden gem and from my part can receive a more central role in the UI as it fits the philosophy of workbenches.
I really like the way that looks. I'm going to play with it, when I get some time. I see a few possible features that would make it even better (like pre-defined workflows that create tabs for specific workbenches), but otherwise, it looks perfect!
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triplus
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby triplus » Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:58 am

Joel_graff wrote:
Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:07 pm
I'll check it out. Below is a link to the Bentley Microstation (CONNECT Edition) UI. They inplement exactly what I was talking about above, with a dropdown to choose different workflows that reorganizes the ribbon UI.
That happens in FreeCAD already? There is a dropdown workbench selector to choose different workbenches and a set of tools from it. Some geared towards Architecture, Mechanical, Transportation purposes. Therefore from conceptual/paradigm point of view i don't see much difference. They use ribbon alike bar to place commands and we use toolbars. Each having its pros and cons. It more or less comes down to on how to place commands. There i guess could be a bar with some special grid alike layout in it. Likely some would use it and some not. ATM there likely is 1 users out there that uses text on toolbars. But the solution exists. I occasionally see a TabBar user in the wild:

https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic. ... 50#p219421

Or as @safri_jefro pointed out. There are solutions like Selector toolbar, Command panel, PieMenu, Launcher ... Now it is possible to position such toolbars in different workbenches and for them to persist in that position cross FreeCAD starts. That wasn't always true. There are ongoing efforts like navigation cube. Users changing themes and icons ... In short some will like one some another area or approach. This effort is also getting nice reviews:

https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23053

Some don't share the sentiment though. Therefore i guess we need all of them in the end anyway? ;)

P.S. I know what i have to do. That is to finish the FreeCAD related UX modules i started. As for the rest i am sure others will come and evolve the FreeCAD UX area further. Note that it won't aways be easy. But thanks in advance for fighting the good fight.
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Joel_graff
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby Joel_graff » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:54 am

triplus wrote:
Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:58 am
This effort is also getting nice reviews:

https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23053

They use ribbon alike bar to place commands and we use toolbars. Each having its pros and cons. It more or less comes down to on how to place commands. There i guess could be a bar with some special grid alike layout in it. Likely some would use it and some not. ATM there likely is 1 users out there that uses text on toolbars.

...

Some don't share the sentiment though. Therefore i guess we need all of them in the end anyway? ;)

P.S. I know what i have to do. That is to finish the FreeCAD related UX modules i started. As for the rest i am sure others will come and evolve the FreeCAD UX area further. Note that it won't aways be easy. But thanks in advance for fighting the good fight.
I love that UI - I've been watching it for a while. I'd probably use them, even though I really prefer docked menus/toolbars over floating (though I guess those toolbars are dockable as well)...

On the larger issue, I admit, I'm just learning about the efforts that have been made towards improving the UI. Maybe it wold be valuable to promote alternate UI's for FreeCAD as a selling point. In fact, I think maybe we should try to build a ribbon UI after all! That would likely been seen as a positive by new users, even if the power users don't care for it. That's fine, though - no one has to use it. Even LibreOffice uses toolbars by default - you have to go out of your way to switch on the Ribbon UI...

Anyway, I'm a bit of a UI geek - I love seeing different UI arrangements, even though I have specific preferences. It's sort of like Linux distro-hopping. :lol:
FreeCAD Trails workbench for transportation engineering: https://www.github.com/joelgraff/freecad.trails

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triplus
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby triplus » Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:59 am

Sure.

P.S. Just note that it can easily take a few years to get to something matured.
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HakanSeven12
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby HakanSeven12 » Wed May 15, 2019 8:00 pm

I don't like default ui too. I think ribbon ui gives FreeCAD a modern look. Maybe it would be an option. Like if you like the default one you can use it, if you want to ribbon just select it from preferences.
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Kunda1
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Re: UI redesign question

Postby Kunda1 » Wed May 15, 2019 11:53 pm

HakanSeven12 wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 8:00 pm
I don't like default ui too. I think ribbon ui gives FreeCAD a modern look. Maybe it would be an option. Like if you like the default one you can use it, if you want to ribbon just select it from preferences.
heads up, please don't necrobump threads. Instead open a new one and reference the old one. Thanks
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