Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

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symbolicM
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Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby symbolicM » Thu Oct 04, 2018 8:03 pm

Newly installed 0.17 Revision 13541 on Ubuntu 18.04 LTS
experience level; noob

First up; shouldn't there be a sticky topic section to discuss the tutorials alone?
There is a lot to learn if you are taking FreeCAD software as a point of entry into the world of 3D.
In the face of the wall awe it is easy for a newcomer to feel less than qualified to comment - at all.

Here is something I noticed while taking on the tutorials one by one starting with part design:

In Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

[wiki]https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/Basic_P ... torial_017[/wiki]

Under subheading Features with pocket and external geometry.

On the following two instructions:
"1. Select one of the horizontal lines apply a horizontal distance constraint and a value of 5 mm.
2. Select one of the vertical lines and give it a vertical distance constraint and a value of 11 mm."

Action described results in the following error message if either the (Shift+H) Fix the horizontal distance constraint or (Shift+V) Fix the vertical distance constraint tool is used:

"Cannot set the datum because the sketch contains conflicting constraints"
Image

However upon experimentation; (Shit+D) Fix length tool yields no such error message.

I suggest an update to the tutorial text and request a pointer to a neat out-of-the way spot on the forums or else-ware to report any further issues I stumble across. Please forgive my ignorance if such a system exists and my forum searches were inadequate to discover it.

symbolicM
ordinary by design
___
ordinary by design
chrisb
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby chrisb » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:01 am

symbolicM wrote:
Thu Oct 04, 2018 8:03 pm
First up; shouldn't there be a sticky topic section to discuss the tutorials alone?
There is a dedicated subforum. I move the topic.
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HarryGeier
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby HarryGeier » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:45 pm

Well, as long as 0.18 is not close to be released, we should NOT change the 0.17 Tutorials or make 0.18 Tutorials, as specifically in the constraints and solver mechanisms there have been changes and may still happen.
As soon as we see 0.18 beeing feature frozen, there will be 0.18 Tutorials coming up.
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NormandC
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby NormandC » Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:03 pm

I think that Basic Part Design Tutorial should be renamed to Basic Part Design Tutorial_old or something, and Basic Part Design Tutorial 017 should be renamed to Basic Part Design Tutorial with no version info. We'll have to decide anyway when v0.18 comes out. Creating a new copy ending with 018 does not make sense in the long run, or we'll have to duplicate pages every time a new version comes out! And 6 months after release, less and less people use v0.16.

Unfortunately, I do not know if renaming the 0.17 page to the original one would mess up the translations. Or, if it would even be possible to reuse the older name, even when it's been "liberated".

As for the slight differences between v0.17 and v0.18, we could probably add some comments about it right in the current tutorial. In time, we can remove mentions of older workflow (0.17). Those of us who contribute content to the wiki are very few, let's not give ourselves more work than we can handle.

Also useful to know, we can link to older revisions of a page. So, once v0.18 is released, we could update pages, then add a mention "this page is written for FreeCAD v0.18. For use with v0.17, click on this link: https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/index.p ... did=324170
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HarryGeier
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby HarryGeier » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:15 pm

Normandc,

yes.. i agree...
Kaum macht man´s richtig , gehts´s
My Video Tutorials on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCoe3B ... p8Q/videos
My FreeCAD Stuff on Hidrive: https://my.hidrive.com/share/qr3l1yddy6#$/
chrisb
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby chrisb » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:25 pm

NormandC wrote:
Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:03 pm
I think that Basic Part Design Tutorial should be renamed to Basic Part Design Tutorial_old or something, and Basic Part Design Tutorial 017 should be renamed to Basic Part Design Tutorial with no version info.
+1
Most tutorials will not change to 0.18 anyway.

The transition from 0.16 to 0.17 went much smoother than I had expected. (Even a certain french user seems to get acquainted with 0.17.) People take 0.17 and that's it.
We can consider going even further: If people have stick to 0.16, which is true for Win-XP users, we might redirect them to Roland's tutorials, so we can remove the old version completely.
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NormandC
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby NormandC » Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:53 pm

Thanks guys, since the two of you agree, I will try to rename the pages - and create a redirect so that links to Basic Part Design Tutorial 017 are not broken.
ubiquity
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby ubiquity » Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:30 am

Sorry to intrude on a discussion where most of the original comments relate to understanding this particular tutorial, but the subsequent discussion seems to have evolved into naming tutorials and whether tutorials should be made for development releases rather than the current stable release.
My two penny worth is as follows:
Divide the Wiki Tutorial pages into
  • Current Release (or Version) Tutorials: containing most of the existing tutorials as they are presently laid out;
  • Prior Release (or Version) Tutorials: containing previous tutorials suitably labelled for the release to which they apply; and
  • Development Release Tutorials: containing tutorials (perhaps developed from Current or Prior Release ones) incorporating features that are only available in development versions - they can then be modified as the development version changes and placed in the Current Release section at the appropriate time together with any superseded tutorials being moved to the prior release section if appropriate.
In that way those (perhaps most) people using the current stable release have access to the most appropriate tutorials. If changes between releases do not affect a tutorial then it simply remains in the Current Release section.
Assuming that people are always encouraged to use the current release (and this is clearly to be preferred for bug reporting) only that tutorial section would require setting out in the present pleasing manner.
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chrisb
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby chrisb » Thu Oct 25, 2018 6:27 am

ubiquity wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:30 am
Divide the Wiki Tutorial pages
If there are completely new tutorials this might be a way to go, but if there are only minor changes ...
NormandC wrote:
Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:03 pm
As for the slight differences between v0.17 and v0.18, we could probably add some comments about it right in the current tutorial. In time, we can remove mentions of older workflow (0.17). Those of us who contribute content to the wiki are very few, let's not give ourselves more work than we can handle.
... it is much easier to make them and add a comment in the same tutorial.

We are really not many working on the documentation.
ubiquity
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Re: Comments on: Basic Part Design Tutorial 017

Postby ubiquity » Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:40 am

Yes in that regard I can agree - but there usually comes a time when there is so much annotation regarding version specific material that a new tutorial is desirable if not mandatory. Your tutorial aimed at v 0.18 is clearly a candidate for such a new tutorial but perhaps presently less relevant to new users of v 0.17.
OS - Linux Mint 19 & Win10 (both 64bit)
IT Training & Support (retired)
Cheers Paul