FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Have some feature requests, feedback, cool stuff to share, or want to know where FreeCAD is going? This is the place.
User avatar
bejant
Posts: 5423
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:06 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby bejant » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:55 pm

ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:50 pm
And where would I shut off the navigation cube?
Edit > Preferences > Display (icon in left pane) > 3D view (tb at top of right pane) > "Show navigation cube".
Jee-Bee
Posts: 1630
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:32 am
Location: Netherlands

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby Jee-Bee » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:56 pm

I think I understand the confusion. It looks like it has something to do with third angle an first angle.
What for third angle left on the left side is. is with first angle left on the right side.
Its true that the dice don't follow these settings / whatever...

on the other hand when there is a real dice in front of you and somebody ask to turn it to the left... what you gonna do...
ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:50 pm
And where would I shut off the navigation cube?
preferences>>Display>>3D View and there remove checkmark by "Show navigation cube"
ajoeiam
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:36 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby ajoeiam » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:58 pm

bejant wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:34 pm
ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:14 am
you are limiting yourself to looking only at the outside of the cube - - - why?
Because there are no interior faces to a solid cube; the faces are all on the outside.

ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:36 am
My problem comes in the nomenclature.
What is called the Top view really isn't the view of the top of the item its the view of the topside of the bottom of the piece.
What is called the Bottom view is actually the bottom of the top of the piece.
Where do you see this nomenclature? I need to see your example.

In Sketcher, after you select Create Sketch, a pop-up window appears and you are asked to select a Plane, but the pop-up window contains an illustration of a Cube. Is that what is confusing you?
Except a solid cube is rarely ever built.
When I fabricate a cube I need to modify certain things in the interior to get the exterior to comply with what is needed.

I don't find the Cube nor the Plane confusing its the nomenclature that's confusing.

When I look at the cube and it says 'Top' what is actually being referred to is, to my way of thinking anyway, the top of the bottom plane. The referred to plane is not the top of the top of the cube.

This may be the difference between designer thinking and fabricator thinking - - - I dunno?
openBrain
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby openBrain » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:43 pm

ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:58 pm
Except a solid cube is rarely ever built.
When I fabricate a cube I need to modify certain things in the interior to get the exterior to comply with what is needed.
What would you modify inside a cube ? If you saw or mill a cube in a block, inside is raw material.
When I look at the cube and it says 'Top' what is actually being referred to is, to my way of thinking anyway, the top of the bottom plane. The referred to plane is not the top of the top of the cube.
This may be the difference between designer thinking and fabricator thinking - - - I dunno?
I still don't fully understand, but AFAIK fabricators read drawings that are generated by designers.
FreeCAD views just stick to the standard mechanical engineering (example below is US projection ; it's different for EU designers, but this one is a better picture of what happens if you "unfold" the cube). ;)
Image
ajoeiam
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:36 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby ajoeiam » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:11 pm

openBrain wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:43 pm
ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:58 pm
Except a solid cube is rarely ever built.
When I fabricate a cube I need to modify certain things in the interior to get the exterior to comply with what is needed.
What would you modify inside a cube ? If you saw or mill a cube in a block, inside is raw material.
When I look at the cube and it says 'Top' what is actually being referred to is, to my way of thinking anyway, the top of the bottom plane. The referred to plane is not the top of the top of the cube.
This may be the difference between designer thinking and fabricator thinking - - - I dunno?
I still don't fully understand, but AFAIK fabricators read drawings that are generated by designers.
FreeCAD views just stick to the standard mechanical engineering (example below is US projection ; it's different for EU designers, but this one is a better picture of what happens if you "unfold" the cube). ;)
Image
Trades guys use drawings to fabricate. Sometimes things work as per the drawing - - - other times one needs to understand what the designer wants and then modify what they have on the drawing to get a functioning item. Some of the the stuff I've seen on drawings - - - LOL - - - you can tell they have never really worked on or with what they designed.

OK the drawing seems quite straight forward - - - except - - - now the drawing is of a room (with features).
Look at the 'Cube' again - - - not that what the Cube calls 'Top' is actually the floor plan its not really the top of the room.
Look at what is referred to as the 'Bottom' - - - is that actually the bottom of the structure or is it the top of the inside of the cube. I don't think its actually the bottom (underside of the floor) on the room.

These variances I find confusing - - - sorry.

(I've worked in a building that was 600' x 150' with a 60' wall height (might have been more wall height - - - it was 96 steps to the mezzanine!). There were two complete processing lines in that building. Drawing that building it would be quite useful to have a nomenclature that connected with any and all users. (My projects will NOT be that large but may be more complex that that facility (where things were very large but the parts count wasn't that high).)
openBrain
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby openBrain » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:28 am

ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:11 pm
OK the drawing seems quite straight forward - - - except - - - now the drawing is of a room (with features).
Look at the 'Cube' again - - - not that what the Cube calls 'Top' is actually the floor plan its not really the top of the room.
Look at what is referred to as the 'Bottom' - - - is that actually the bottom of the structure or is it the top of the inside of the cube. I don't think its actually the bottom (underside of the floor) on the room.
:?: Now I'm totally lost. :lol:
Sorry if it sounds idiot, but wouldn't you be the victim of an optical illusion due to cube transparency ?
Here "Top" is well the top (overside) of the "roof" and "Bottom" is the bottom (underside) of the "floor".
ajoeiam
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:36 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby ajoeiam » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:57 pm

openBrain wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:28 am
ajoeiam wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:11 pm
OK the drawing seems quite straight forward - - - except - - - now the drawing is of a room (with features).
Look at the 'Cube' again - - - not that what the Cube calls 'Top' is actually the floor plan its not really the top of the room.
Look at what is referred to as the 'Bottom' - - - is that actually the bottom of the structure or is it the top of the inside of the cube. I don't think its actually the bottom (underside of the floor) on the room.
:?: Now I'm totally lost. :lol:
Sorry if it sounds idiot, but wouldn't you be the victim of an optical illusion due to cube transparency ?
Here "Top" is well the top (overside) of the "roof" and "Bottom" is the bottom (underside) of the "floor".
OK - - - - draw a rectangle - - - its supposed to be the floor plan.
Its listed as the xy plane (which it should be). to get the proper orientation the view in Sketcher needs to read 'Top' - - - - but its a floor plan its not a layout of the ceiling (or the decking above the ceiling).

The face labeling is accurate if one ONLY is working on outside features. As soon as one is working on outside AND inside features - - - well the whole labeling nomenclature is - - - -well - - - honestly - - - - at least very confusing and at a most negative view - - - inaccurate.
openBrain
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby openBrain » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:15 pm

Maybe, despite I'd never been confused by that.
Actually the purpose of "Top view" isn't to "show the user the top of its model", but to "show the current object from a top PoV".
DingBEN
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:17 am

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby DingBEN » Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:02 am

3 points: please refer the number of the point you will address.

1. If all posts would quote the version of FreeCAD (in my case 1.7)... WIN 7 Pro

2. Under Edit/Preferences/Display/3D - I see no mention of showing/hiding said cube!?
Please someone clear this up!?

3. As for the interpretation of the VIEW perspective it seems the CNC layman indeed has a mind-block to overcome.
Just as when a number is unsigned in mathematics representation, a '+' is assumed, thus 1 = +1
In 3D view perspective, the words 'from' and 'out' are assumed... (from, out)Front, (from, out)Top, ...
or (out)Front, (out)Top, ...

3.b Another analogy would be the wind direction: a North wind comes FROM the North. (FROM always assumed)
Thus wind NW, 10mph follows the path from the pivot to the point of the hour hand on a clock that resides at 4:30 or 16:30 position.
The observer is facing the pivot point while standing at the point of the hand(facing NW), receiving a zephyr of 10 miles per hour, blowing on and around the face, then past the ears.
User avatar
bejant
Posts: 5423
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:06 pm

Re: FreeCad learning curve - - - another perspective

Postby bejant » Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:01 pm

DingBEN wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:02 am
1. If all posts would quote the version of FreeCAD (in my case 1.7)... WIN 7 Pro

2. Under Edit/Preferences/Display/3D - I see no mention of showing/hiding said cube!?
Please someone clear this up!?
It was introduced in 0.18, so you don't have it in your 0.17 version...